Thread: New Domain using keyword

Hello,
Beth has been kind enough to help me but I thought that this would be an excellent time/place to seek additional info.
A domain name that uses my principal keyword(s) is available.
I am using xxxxx's for the real domain that I would like to keep private until I make a purchase(s).
One is www.xxxx-xxxxxx.com the other is www.xxxxxxxxx.biz (same keywords except for the " - " in the .com domain
Would either have an advantage over the other?
If I chose to do a redirect and a customer entered "xxxxxxxxxx" would this be seen as a website in the SE listings?
or, I choose to use the domain as another website.I would have to use similar info on the new site as on the current site. Notice I said similar and not duplicate. Images would have different alt tags and names.
Can I penalized for "duplicate content"?
If so, there are many websites (none that I own) that carry myproducts and use content very, very similar to waht I currently use. Am I being penalized for that?
Thanks

eh Terry, Beth's been travelling but recently said she'd be along here soon ..
I'll give you my personal thoughts, I'd likely choose the - as opposed to the .biz, the worst about it is anyone remembering to use the -, but it's likely better since it's a .com and the se's seem to have no difficulty using - in anything, seems an advantage if there is one .bah on the .biz, lol - if you purchase both and do a redirect, it doesn't mean you'll get a double listing, your redirect doesn't have any content on it, or it shouldn't, but anyone typing in the address bar would be redirected ..
Duplicate, there is a lot to take into consideration on this, but, I'd aim for 70% new content to avoid duplicate content between your own sites, I'd say you are fine with the fact others are selling the same products, again there is much to consider on this one.
P.S. your siggie is very long, much longer than it should be, if u can do anything to shorten it up that'd be great, just to stay withi the terms, I at least see one duplicate, and what about these two new ones :(

I don't believe you've seen this thread Terry ..

LadyEye

Thanks for the info about the siggie. I didn't realize that there was a limit to the # of URLs that could be listed. And also for the tip about my promotion!!!

I have not been really clear about my concerns.

When a prospective customer enters my main keyword (or at least one of the most common terms) my site comes up page 4 on Google. It's much higher (usually page 1) on other SE's.
Still, Google is my concern.
I think, correct me if I'm wrong, that if I had an URL that was the same as the search term, I would have to be pretty high in the Google returns (eventually)?
Would a redirect help me then using the new site?

What would constitute "new content"?
All images would have different alt tags.
Of course my keywords would be repetitive.

yw terry ..

first ..

your archery domain - is it 4 sale? or perhaps the link is incorrect? U need to check ..

While I was looking Terry I noticed that you could add a fair bit more to your page titles and descriptions. Remember, these are the words that tend to get listed on the search pages and need to match up of course, with your page content. Text that is. So, I'll bet you can do a whole lot better than page 4 if u wanted to look into it and apply that logic. Your websites are really really nicely presented Terry, always.
Having your "Keywords" in your domain name is without a doubt, totally relevant, useful and helpful in terms of your listing. It's always good if the name says it all. I find redirects useful to point to a website that would have the same content, e.g., a .com and a .net extension of the same domain name, or perhaps an old website name and you were going with a fresh new domain name but keeping the website, I would still keep my old domain and redirect ..or sometimes domain names that are close in wording, I'd probably buy both. I cant say that a redirect would help you with the new site, even without seeing the name - reason, because of the - and or the .biz - both are not so common .. but I wouldn't count out other opinions. But it's my thought that a redirect is used to do just that, to redirect from something someone would potentially type in to find your domain, or following a link that has been planted and the site or page has been moved or changed - typing in the - , is also not so common, nor is the .biz .. so I don't think so in this case.
Well we know that alt tags are used on images to identify them in the case they do not load or can't be seen by some, and well you may or may not have different names for them, you might call a mountain, a mountain, I might call a mountain a hill, however, all within reason, but this isn't going to count or contribute much to your duplicate content. If you did create two websites, you wouldn't use duplicate keywords. Your writings about your product would need to be different, otherwise it would be seen as duplicate, and your keywords should reflect your writings, so no, you wouldn't use duplicate keywords. Images, in fact would be fine, and preferred and a different text description and content is what you would want to do and for certain a different navigation, linking and page naming, then I'd say you would be okay and would not be considered duplicate content. Now, here is something u might think about .. the domain name is not everything, if you cannot get your preferred domain name in a .com extension, you might consider other names and get a .com. You can apply the writings on your website to reflect your content in it's preferred name, even while your domain name is not the exact keywording you are looking for .. yes you can.

I submitted a support ticket a couple of hours ago. I'm not sure why I am offline. I checked my modernbilling account and I have no outstanding invoices??????

As far as content, my index page for redhawk is the centerpiece of the site. Visitors can reach my index page and then go directly to the page that the photos and the first text link point to. The linked page produces 99% of income from the site.
I hesitate using precise names as these forum pages can show up in searches eventually.
Let me ask the question somewhat differently.
My main keyword(s) are xxxx xxxxx, or xxxxxxxxx.
Would a site URL xxxx-xxxxx.com or xxxxxxxxx.biz be of any advantage as a redirect for any of the above keyword searches to get to my current URL?
Sorry if I am being dense about this.

My 2 cents?

Avoid any symbol use in any domain that you wish to back up with a site (deem worthy of investment), be it a .COM or otherwise ..... in this instance, it looks like the greater value would be use the hyphenated domain as the re-direct (since it would likely pop as a result based on natural Searches), and the .BIZ could end up being more effective as a Content-rich and "optimized" site, relying on the better build and perfected model (if you really think a .BIZ extension plays into it: it doesn't so much anymore as it did 5 years ago, and proof is the position attained by a .NET in our group without the benefit of having any support from other domains, extensions, or lateral sites).

IMO

Thank you Vasili. I think I will try and redirect the hyphenated domain as a redirect. I can't see any downside other than a few $$$$'s.
I could use a slightly different (a word berfore or after) URL and avoid the hyphenated URL and still keep my primary keyword in the URL?

Heck, Terry....the days of the old domain rules are pretty much shot, with all the fallout from the domain speculators and the consequences still felt today (where they are all snapped up automatically in micro-seconds and stuck in auctions), so if you are in a position where a few bucks is not an issue, then go ahead and get your best available phrase, if possible......tis better than a simple 2-3 words of they are not "natural" combinations, you know?
I use a few re-directs and forwarded 1-pagers per each "important" site myself, and am careful to do things by the old school means, but they still add up to the same thing you are facing here.....*******tion vs duplication, and being in "compliance" aqll the while creating the maximum benefit possible just because details are attended to....

The extensions aren't as much of an element in the quation, IF you remember to 'balance' values with construct as I mentioned above: compensate with more perfect builds, deeper (richer) Content, and by the time you're done, the relevance can't be ignored!

IMO

Thanks Vasili.
As always your comments are well taken.
I cannot see how I could have content on new sites without duplication. My keywords are very precise, niche market terms.
Would it still benefit if I used a straight redirect with no content?

A few more thoughts.....
the perfect URL for me would be www.asdfghjk.com
This site already exists but has nothing to do with my products. It's a completely different area however, it is a perfect match for my main keyword.
If I Google " asdfghjk " this website never appears in the search results. How could similar URLs help me if they were just a redirect?

Originally Posted by CarbonTerry

Thanks Vasili.
As always your comments are well taken.
I cannot see how I could have content on new sites without duplication. My keywords are very precise, niche market terms.
Would it still benefit if I used a straight redirect with no content?

Originally Posted by CarbonTerry

A few more thoughts.....
the perfect URL for me would be www.asdfghjk.com
This site already exists but has nothing to do with my products. It's a completely different area however, it is a perfect match for my main keyword.
If I Google " asdfghjk " this website never appears in the search results. How could similar URLs help me if they were just a redirect?

"NO" and "They can't -- much" Simple re-directs cannot help if they do not have a simple one-page Content base to re-direct from, as that would be "forwarding" and not re-direction!

Only static elements get "read"/cached, and for all intents and purposes, the Page Title is still the most important elment and needs to be present to associate any value or "relevance" to the URL and forward to another URL or "site" .......

There are scripts available to allow the one simple page with limited content to automatically be re-directing after a set time rather than make the visitor physically do it themselves.

You need to make up your mind ..... re-direct or forward, and whether or not your effort is worthy to lock up the availability "prematurely" (get the domain while still available, only to do an auto-direct by script from a one page) or simply forward it and place all your value on the primary site.

Vasili,
Thank you for your patience and willingness to answer my questions !!!
I think that the "forwarding" concept is my original thought. Buy the domain name(s), add relevant content (small amount?) and then use the script to forward to my established website.
woohoo......with your help, I have seen 'The Light."
Is there a method (AWstats?) to determine traffic from a "forwarded" URL?

I am still not able to figure out why my main site is so far down the SE results when compared to competitor's. I think that mine is far more optimised than others (of course, I would..duh) Could it be that in my attempt to optmise that I am actually seen as spamming?
www.redhawk-archery.com

Thanks

Thanks Vasili,
By spamming I meant just throwing in keywords that did not follow a logical sequence and the like.
There are other URL's that I have control of that are listed high but these are niche market terms.
On any other SE my redhawk website is postioned very high. Usually p1 or p2 that's where I am in a quandary about Google. (me and the rest of the world!!).
I am going to purchase a couple of relevant keyword/domain names as forwarders and see if I can detect an increase in my sales.

Originally Posted by CarbonTerry

Vasili,
Thank you for your patience and willingness to answer my questions !!!
I think that the "forwarding" concept is my original thought. Buy the domain name(s), add relevant content (small amount?) and then use the script to forward to my established website.
woohoo......with your help, I have seen 'The Light."

Is there a method (AWstats?) to determine traffic from a "forwarded" URL?

I am still not able to figure out why my main site is so far down the SE results when compared to competitor's. I think that mine is far more optimised than others (of course, I would..duh) Could it be that in my attempt to optmise that I am actually seen as spamming?
www.redhawk-archery.com Thanks

No problem, Brother! As a fellow "Defender" (I'm ex-Ranger) we already know how to work as a Team, and VodaTalk is merely another "unit" of personal progress, right?? LOL

AWStats (and especially Google Analytics, as this is something you embed on a page in the "Before Head") will give good numbers on a re-directed page, but there is nothing to track via forwarding --- there is no "page hit" or even "referring link" (which is a static element of a page).

Personally??
No-one wants to bring it up, but I will: I believe that sites built using a "generator" such as BV which depends on blending HTML and CSS governance for styles will always fare below expectations .... it is the nature of how the spiders are 'encumbered' trying to make allowances to properly read and evaluate a "style" that although seems to logistically comply with all the details of SEO it is still a more complicated evaluation process than necessary. In other words, BV allows you to build sites "by the numbers" and do all the pre-optimization that is practical and standard, but the fabric BV uses is just slightly different enough for the SE's to think it "second-class" to other formats, such as 100% php (as might be seen in a CMS foundation like a Joomla or Xoops build) or straight HTML (as might be seen via Dreamweaver).

If you summarize all the posts here in VT on how sites have zoomed to the top, it is usually a result of being a new site, a really tight KW use, a quirky use of a Key Phrase that may be under represented or new altogether, or some other "oddity" metric --- since if you check back the next month, these same sites have fallen inexplicably to deep positions from the Top the once enjoyed. Pride goeth before a fall, eh?

There is a lot of chatter on the web about this, and how CSS can be best "modified" to be less of a problem when sites are not 100% CSS, like how blending CSS and Flash is being somewhat effective in making Flash more acceptable. Things like that....you still have to read between the lines at times, but the fact remains "blends" do not fare well (as in BV = CSS+HTML).

* That is why I always am harping on the emphasis of Content development, Perfect Page Model build constructs, and dotting every "i" and crossing every "t" when it comes to the details we CAN prepare in BV like Meta development, H-Meta, etc.

No, that would be unlikely, unless you have been doing too much email distribution and have gotten a warning not only from your ISP but VH also: being warned about email also follows to your site, which is temporarily ID'd as a potential violator, and that has negative consequences.

Vasili,
Thanks again. I have purchased the domain peep-sights.com and made a simple one page site trying to create unique content and not duplicate the redhawk index page. If shoppers are interested they can click on a link which will take them directly to the redhawk site where they can purchase immediately.
Your thoughts??

Originally Posted by CarbonTerry

Vasili,
Thanks again. I have purchased the domain peep-sights.com and made a simple one page site trying to create unique content and not duplicate the redhawk index page. If shoppers are interested they can click on a link which will take them directly to the redhawk site where they can purchase immediately.Your thoughts??

Go ahead and put something up so I can take a look at it....I have some ideas especially useful to your genrre, but I would like to see what you do first, so not to cramp your style or suggest something more than need be. I am all too aware of my inclination to expect more from myself than most would from themselves, so seeing your efforts will give me some sort of a base from which to refine/guage my suggestions.....deal?

Vasili,
Deal.......already posted.
Click on www.peep-sights.com & www.redhawk-archery.com
redhawk is the original site

OK, FINE! (You sly Fox, you!)

1. Treat this domain/site as a pure "slave" and make it serve the Almighty RedHawk site with the metrics it can --- and this may co-incide with further development of the RH site, or be cause to undertake more effort, I dunno ----- Use this single page as a perfect way to create specific value "inbound links" to RH: single sentences that "invite" visitors to drill in for more info about technical aspects, additional related info, benefits, features, differences, etc....these all can be short but meaning-packed descriptive sentences that use a lot of KW on this page, and link to real core relevance Content on the RH site....Visitors will not mind thus seeing this on-pager as a type of "portal" as long as it also is richly laced with useful content or NAVIGATION, which is the fulfillment of their "search" that landed them there in the first place, right?
2. This inbound link structure is important, because if worded/presented right, it will deliver real core traffic to certain INTERIOR pages of your main RH site, which is the finest examples of structuring net-wide relevancy, not relying solely on the tight weaving of CVontent and Meta on the RH site (* HINT: use "bookmarked" links especially, not just to the page in general >> demonstrate specific areas of Highly Valued Content, and the SE's will usually take your suggestion and do so as well)....it will add exponentially to trackable SE value of page visits and relevancy value that is solid and measurable: traffic is specifically LINKED to focused Content, and the more traffic delivered to that COntent, the more the SE's will attribute value in both relevancy and for their own cached purposes to offer results to their Search requests (a redundant means to self-elevate the import of your Content, as if the SE's are too non-human to recognize the value of the content and must rely on traffic to be an indicator). This really is pumping up the core metric of visits = import, and if you offer more nav/inbound links on the one-pager to deliver to more pages or more sections of RH content,the more you will actually attract to the one pager (initially) and to RH eventually (which, in time, will be the true repository of Relevancy).
3. In time, this will require you to "rotate in" new KW and INBOUND links to the 1 pager, as you continue to develop and add Content to RH....thus, new injection of SE valued traffic based on ever wider demonstrated relevance and "status" of the Portal, having been a 'favored' indicator site in the past..... This should also point ou the need to include more ancillary images than the main focus of the portal as it is now.....since you can title them and tag them with added KW/phrases and info moreso than straight text, since you can use them as icon hyperlinks also....images thus have more versatility than plain text in this type of use on this type of site.
4. So....try thinking of this site not so much as a "portal" or "slave/traffic cop" but as an "internet directory" (they don't have to be big or fancy, you know)....make it appear to be the best source of hard-linked specific topical Content....this way it is appealing to visitors, SE's, and the FUNCTIONS you can derive from it without appearing in the slightest as a 'referrer" site...(sub-doamins have been completely dis-favored in the last 5 months, due mostly to them being the favorite means for spammers to clone off sites and means to infect the net, and this has created new "familiarization methods" by Google especially to view uncharacteristically created sites with suspicion first).

Starting to see the logic?


I can go on and on, but think if you want to know more, you should email me personally....It has been a VERY long week full of predictable disasters and unnecessary crises, and I think I am finally and "Officially" pooped!